everything to be atomized

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everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
This post was updated on .
EDIT:
Most of this stuff does not need to be atomized right now.  There are more important things to be done, namely fixing the carrier-transport bug, the paratroopers bug, and then getting triplea to support the newest a&a rules for a&a pacific 1940 and the upcoming europe and world.
edit done.


If we are going to break compatibility for one thing, we might as well break it for everything

here is a list of everything that needs to be broken up into its component parts:

isStrategicBomber (does 2 things)
  -  isStrategicBomber (only strategic bombs)
  -  isAirTransport (require paratroopers tech on to work)


isInfantry (does 2 things)
  -  isAirTransportable
  -  isGroundTransportable or just keep it as isInfantry (allows movement with the mechanized tech)


canBlitz (does 2 things)
  -  canBlitz (just allows blitzing of territories)
  -  isGroundTransport / isMechanizedTechTransport / isMechanized


isMarine (does 2 things)
  -  isMarine (just does the amphibious assault boost just for itself)
  -  isGroundTransportable or just keep it as isInfantry (allows movement with the mechanized tech)


isSub (does 4 things)
  -  isFirstStrike
  -  isRetreat (can either submerge [ww2v2-v3-v4] or can retreat [ww2v1, nap empires] depending on the rules set and game properties)
  -  isCanNotHitAir
  -  isCanNotBeHitByAir (depending on the rules set, either air is allowed 1 round to hit it [ww2v2], or air does not hit it ever at all, unless an isDestroyer is present [ww2v3-v4])
(any unit with isRetreat can be affected by the supersubs tech)


isDestroyer (does 3 things)
  -  isAntiFirstStrike
  -  isAntiRetreat (prevents submerge and retreat)
  -  isAllowAirToHitSub (only useful under v3 rules)
(any unit with the isAntiRetreat can be affected by the destroyersBombard tech)


transportCapacity (does 2 things)
  -  transportCapacity  (allows transporting units)
  -  isSeaTransport  (this only functions to turn on and off features like not being able to take convoy zones, not being able to be taken casualty during v3 rules, etc.)
(alternatively you could do a "isNOTseaTransport" which might work better because it is more of an exception)


isAA (does 8 things)
  -  isAAgunForCombat (hits airplanes during regular combat only)
  -  isAAgunForSBR (hits airplanes during strat bombing only [this distinction is needed for the new pacific map])
  -  aaGunAttacksAt [x] (has a value equal to x, default is 1, and the radar tech doubles that value)
  -  isCapturable
  -  isCanNotBeDestroyed
  -  isHasFunnyMovementRules (aaGuns have funny movement rules)
  -  isRocket (shoots rockets if you have the tech)
  -  RocketRange (currently defaults to 3)
(any unit with the isAAgunForXXX can be affected by Radar tech)

isFactory (does 4 things)
  -  isCapturable
  -  isCanNotBeDestroyed
  -  canProduceByTerritoryValue (can be over-written with the territory attachment known as "originalFactory" and also over-written with placeanywhere v3 type rules)
  -  canProduceX [x] (has a value equal to x, meaning that this factory can produce X units, no matter where it is placed)
(any unit with the canProduceX or canProduceByTerritoryValue can be affected by the IncreasedFactoryProduction technology)



to be complete we also need these:

canBeTakenAsCasualty
isDestroyedIfCaptured  (can not be taken as a hit, but is destroyed if the enemy wins)


edit:
(I got this reply from bung, mentioning something cool)

I'm wondering about this a little. We have people considering space and other new map types and at a higher level I had an obvious comment to make;

What if, instead of isGroundTransportable, isAirTransportable, we had

isTransportType=1,2,3,4,5,6,7...
isTransportableBy=1,3,5,7...

I am not familiar with the current code, however I assume you're just doing an IF/Else on air/ground, and it only needs to be fed into a loop instead.

Thoughts?
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
If we want to keep backwards compatibility (VERY EASY TO DO)
then the following needs to be done:

all you need is to keep the original Property/Attachment doing all the things it currently does
and give new names to the atomized versions.



so for example,
isStrategicBomber currently does 2 things, so it would become 3 properties:
  -  isStrategicBomber = can bomb stuff and if you also have paratroopers tech then you can also carry "isInfantry" and "isAirTransportable" units
  -  isAirTransport = can NOT bomb stuff and if you also have paratroopers tech then you can also carry "isInfantry" and "isAirTransportable" units
  -  isJustStrategicBomber = only bomb stuff, no transporting


more examples:
isSub currently does 4 things, so it would become 5 properties:
  -  isSub = does all 4 things
  -  isFirstStrike
  -  isRetreat (can either submerge [ww2v2-v3-v4] or can retreat [ww2v1, nap empires] depending on the rules set and game properties)
  -  isCanNotHitAir
  -  isCanNotBeHitByAir (depending on the rules set, either air is allowed 1 round to hit it [ww2v2], or air does not hit it ever at all, unless an isDestroyer is present [ww2v3-v4])
(any unit with isSub OR isRetreat can be affected by the supersubs tech)




I think this is the best way to do things
because it makes making maps easier
and it keeps backwards compatibility


here are the issues with breaking backwards compatibility:
 * a map maker may want to do just isSub instead of writing all the different properties and missing one by accident
 * I have to change approximately 150 different xml's (game files), AND re-upload every single map to the database again
 * online community has to redownload ALL of their zip/game files again
 * if someone has both the stable 1.2.5.4 and the unstable 1.2.6.0 then the stable will not work and generate JAVA errors when it runs (or the unstable will generate JAVA errors)
 * a conversion script will: alter people's maps without permission, including maps under development, as well as making 1.2.5.4 not able to run (hence they can no longer play with friends on the stable)
 * a conversion script must be capable of unzipping all the maps, changing them all flawlessly, and rezipping all of them (because they have to be zipped or else the user will be able to download duplicates.  duplicates cause the game to not work and give a java error)
 * you will need two versions of every map, one for the stable, one for the unstable
 * the online community will get really pissed off and leave us




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Re: everything to be atomized

Pulicat
In reply to this post by Veqryn
I was also going to suggest that there be a property hasProductionFrontier for factory units. Essentially an option to tie production frontier to a type of factory, instead of a player as a whole. So perhaps one kind of Factory can build artillery, another cannot.
how now brown cow?
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Re: everything to be atomized

erik542
IsXHit so we can make chuck norris like 5 hits.
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Re: everything to be atomized

Bung
In reply to this post by Veqryn
As replied on the mailing list:

I'm wondering about this a little. We have people considering space and other new map types and at a higher level I had an obvious comment to make;

What if, instead of isGroundTransportable, isAirTransportable, we had

isTransportType=1,2,3,4,5,6,7...
isTransportableBy=1,3,5,7...

I am not familiar with the current code, however I assume you're just doing an IF/Else on air/ground, and it only needs to be fed into a loop instead.
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
In reply to this post by Veqryn
before we go make comradekev's life a living hell with new feature requests....
we may just want to atomize the properties that he can atomize for now, that require conversion of game xmls


basically, if he/we want to add new features in the future, they will not break backwards compatibility

but I would like to start by getting everything done that might or will break backwards compatibility, and get it all done at the same time so that we only have to change all the game zips ONCE

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Re: everything to be atomized

U-boat
In reply to this post by Veqryn
Veqryn, with the factories' isCanNotBeDestroyed  property, could I put that on bunkers so when all other units are gone, the bunkers are turned over to the other player? I've always wanted this.
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
uboat.... i am not going to answer that until and IF it is coded
everything up there is hypothetical, and I'm only creating it to give kev something to go off of
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Re: everything to be atomized

U-boat
I have a suggestion. In addition to these properties I want to see number values as well. For example Advanced Artillery means an artie can support two infantry. Why not make it a tech and a property. So: isSupport=true
canSupport=2 (2 units)
attackSupportBuff=1
defenceSupportBuff=0

That way the game is almost entirely customizable. This would allow for more unique units to be made. So instead of JUST infantry for battle-based maps, maybe we can have flamethrowers, riflemen, snipers, etc. I'm not rushing, it's just an idea. Maybe include a isDugIn property for Japanese defenders on amphibiously assaulted islands. So do this:

isDugIn=true
dugInDefenseBufft=1

Same for isMarine:

isMarine=true
marineAttackBuff=1

Or maybe unit specific boost when attacking certain units. This one might be very hard to code. Not sure:

Tank Buster Unit
isSpecific=1
attackBuff1=1
defendBuff1=1
attackNerf1=0
defendNerf=0

Armour Unit
isSpecific=1
attackBuff1=0
defendBuff1=0
attackNerf1=1
defendNerf=1

This means all units containing isSpecific=1 will act a certain way when those units meet. So when you want a different group to act different together you would use isSpecific=2 to show that this is a new group.

Nerf means reduce. So in this case, whether on attack or defend, when an armour unit meets a tank buster in battle, the tank has a minus 1 attack or defend.

This COULD be problematic since the engine would have to total all buffs and nerfs then recalculate what the unit's actual attack and defend is.

I might be getting ahead of myself, maybe no one would even use these features. Maybe I am just making it too complicated. I guess in the future when people are ready for a challenge it might happen.

Thanks.

EDIT: Above I have:

attackBuff1=0
defendBuff1=0
attackNerf1=1
defendNerf=1

this will have to be changed somehow so that the "1" after nerf and buff is incorporated after the equals sign. So maybe:

attackBuff1=1,0
defendBuff1=1,0
attackNerf1=1,1
defendNerf=1,1

Is this even possible? Any ideas?
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
In reply to this post by Veqryn
1) isMarine
i don't know of ANY maps that isMarine that also use Mechanized tech,
so isMarine can be separated right now without any issues at all


2) StrategicBomber, isInfantry, canBlitz (Paratroopers and Mechanized Technologies)
the number of maps that use paratroopers and mechanized tech is equal to the number of maps that use V3 rules.  This is probably somewhere around the number 30 out of a total of 150 different xml.
i guess I can update them (after the stable is out)

3) all the rest should not break backwards compatibility.  if for the only reason that map makers don't want to type out 8 different attachments when all they want is an AA gun.



So, in conclusion,
kev and sgb, if you guys really want to, go ahead and break backwards compatibility (but only Paratroopers and Mechanized Tech)
don't both with a script, I'll update the map downloads
but I'll only update them after the next stable comes out, because if I update them now, noone on 1.2.5.4 will be able to play them (java errors for attachments that do not exist)

do NOT break backwards compatibility for the other things please (isDestroyer, isSub, isAA, isFactory, transportCapacity)
if you do decide to atomize those 5 attachments, please use the solution I suggested of creating new properties while keeping the original property the same and fully functional.
(i will revolt if backwards compatibility is broken on these 5 )
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Veqryn
Hi kev,
cc sgb.

I have an update for you on the svn you last committed.

but first,
since there are sooooo many feature requests, and so little time, i was going to ask if you could prioritize the following things for the next unstable:

1) a new game property that allows zero movement units to be selected
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=3010714&group_id=44492&atid=439740

2) new player rules attachments for 'produce anywhere, but maximum production per territory set by territory value' and 'produce anywhere, but maximum production per territory is X'
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=3000382&group_id=44492&atid=439740

3) finish coding the 'givePUs' delegate
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=2987406&group_id=44492&atid=439740

4) since you have atomized the "paratroopers" ability, why not also atomize the "mechanized infantry tech" ability
it can be done like this:
<option name="canBlitz" value="true"/> = just blitzes, no longer transports anything with or without tech.
<option name="isInfantry" value="true"/> OR <option name="isMechanized" value="true"/> = this unit can be transported by a unit with the "isMechanizedTechTransport" when you have the "mechanizedInfantry" technology.
and
<option name="isMechanizedTechTransport" value="true"/> = this unit is the ground unit TRANSPORTING the isInfantry OR isMechanized ground unit, when you have the tech of course.
(if you do it like this, you take advantage of using the currently not used "isMechanized" ability, or using the otherwise not used "isInfantry" ability, which is cool.  There is no need to create a new ability here...)
(also: remove "isMarine" from being transported by "mechanizedInfantry" technology.)

5) someone, squiddaddy i think, uploaded some patches for the ai into the patch tracker.  maybe you and sgb could look at them?  moore ai has a lot of logic problems right now, and loves only to attack in battles he is sure to lose.

6) a new button on the main screen of the game: "Help / FAQ" that when clicked just opens an internet browser to the following link: http://tripleadev.1671093.n2.nabble.com/Download-Maps-Links-Hosting-Games-General-Information-tp4074312p4074312.html

7) have the "map downloads" button automatically start with 1 entry: http://downloads.sourceforge.net/project/tripleamaps/triplea_maps.xml
(this is to the sourceforge project i started that you and sgb both have full admin access to.)



after these 4-7 things are done, or even before they are done all the way, could you release an unstable so that more people can test the code?  i think i am the only one testing the source besides you and sgb.





update on svn 2786
i get an out of memory error when switching games, or closing games, when running the source code.  maybe it is because i only have 512mb of ram?  i guess if noone else gets this error, then its just me and my old crappy computer.



1. did you fix the carriers that are transports bug?  your svn does not mention it, but it seems to be fixed?  perhaps one of your fixes to the edit transported units also fixed this by accident?

however, i found a new bug regarding carriers that are also transports: if you have a carrier carrying allied ground units and allied air units, it will not be allowed to move anywhere.  the error message is: "transports can not leave their units"
(this one is really important to fix for 3 games being designed right now)



2. units that start the turn in the same sea zone do not seem to attack each other even if you answer yes to the 'do you want to attack these transports' question.  (i think someone else made a ticket about this)



3. i got that weird "not all units can blitz" error, when only trying to move some units 1 space.
(i have seen this error on the following maps: red sun over china, napoleonic empires, eastern front, feudal japan, and a few others too.
basically, when you go to combat move, you find that you can not move any of your single movement units in a territory.  you are not allowed to move them even to a friendly territory, or to an enemy territory 1 movement away.  the error message is "not all units can blitz".  If you save the game and re-load it, the error goes away.  It seems to happen very randomly, never in the same territory twice, and usually only in the bigger maps.)



4:
ability to edit delete units that have been transported appears to work.

techCost works fine
<option name="techCost" value="x"/>

bombard works fine
<option name="bombard" value="x"/>

the display of tech tokens works fine

kamikaze appears to work fine
<property name="Kamikaze Airplanes" value="true" editable="true">
  <boolean/>
</property>




5. unitsSupported does NOT work:

<attatchment name="unitAttatchment" attatchTo="artillery" javaClass="games.strategy.triplea.attatchments.UnitAttachment" type="unitType">
  <option name="movement" value="1"/>
  <option name="transportCost" value="3"/>
  <option name="attack" value="2"/>
  <option name="defense" value="2"/>
  <option name="artillery" value="true"/>
  <option name="unitsSupported" value="2"/>
</attatchment>


gave me this error:
Could not parse:C:\Documents and Settings\Chris Duncan\My Documents\workspace\TripleA\maps\Unstable_Map_Mods\games\UnstableTestWW2v3-1941.xml
games.strategy.engine.data.GameParseException: No setter for attachment option. Setter:unitsSupported Class:games.strategy.triplea.attatchments.UnitAttachment
    at games.strategy.engine.data.GameParser.setValues(GameParser.java:1181)
    at games.strategy.engine.data.GameParser.parseAttachments(GameParser.java:1101)
    at games.strategy.engine.data.GameParser.parse(GameParser.java:125)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.ui.NewGameChooserEntry.<init>(NewGameChooserEntry.java:27)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.ui.NewGameChooserModel.createEntry(NewGameChooserModel.java:163)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.ui.NewGameChooserModel.populateFromDirectory(NewGameChooserModel.java:180)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.ui.NewGameChooserModel.populate(NewGameChooserModel.java:82)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.ui.NewGameChooserModel.<init>(NewGameChooserModel.java:35)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.startup.mc.GameSelectorModel.loadDefaultGame(GameSelectorModel.java:217)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.startup.ui.MainFrame.<init>(MainFrame.java:61)
    at games.strategy.engine.framework.GameRunner2$1.run(GameRunner2.java:61)
    at java.awt.event.InvocationEvent.dispatch(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventQueue.dispatchEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpOneEventForFilters(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForFilter(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForHierarchy(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.run(Unknown Source)









6. paratroopers has the following issues:

a) I can only load infantry, even if I have set "armor" to be "isAirTransportable" and set the transport capacity of the bomber to 5 or more.

b) If I click to load guys, then i click again, it asks me which i'd like to load, then i select again, then I get the following error:

java.lang.NullPointerException
    at games.strategy.triplea.delegate.MoveValidator.isLoad(MoveValidator.java:415)
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.MovePanel.updateUnitsThatCanMoveOnRoute(MovePanel.java:771)
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.MovePanel.access$22(MovePanel.java:757)
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.MovePanel$5.mouseMoved(MovePanel.java:1818)
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.MapPanel.notifyMouseMoved(MapPanel.java:354)
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.MapPanel.access$15(MapPanel.java:346)
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.MapPanel$2.mouseMoved(MapPanel.java:520)
    at java.awt.AWTEventMulticaster.mouseMoved(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Component.processMouseMotionEvent(Unknown Source)
    at javax.swing.JComponent.processMouseMotionEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Component.processEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Container.processEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Component.dispatchEventImpl(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Container.dispatchEventImpl(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Component.dispatchEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.LightweightDispatcher.retargetMouseEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.LightweightDispatcher.processMouseEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.LightweightDispatcher.dispatchEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Container.dispatchEventImpl(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Window.dispatchEventImpl(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.Component.dispatchEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventQueue.dispatchEvent(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpOneEventForFilters(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForFilter(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForHierarchy(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.run(Unknown Source)


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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
This post was updated on .
6) the link above for number 6 is the thread on this forum.  that thread does not itself host any 'a&a' material, and any references to that material can be removed, if you decide to link to there from TripleA program

7) if you are worried that the download link includes ALL maps, i have made a second download link that includes JUST user-created maps with no possibly copy-righted material
if you wish to use that link instead, it is:
http://downloads.sourceforge.net/project/tripleamaps/basic_map_list.xml


thx,
veqryn


edit:

also, someone submitted a patch that all it does it switch the units in the Battle Calc,

8) a button that switches the units in the battle calc  (so all units on offense go to defense, and all units in defense go to offense [and the nationalities switch too]).  Someone already submitted a patch for this, so sgb/kev only needs to include it.
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
kev, sgb.... you guys got my email with this stuff and the email with the big world stuff?
anything happening?
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Re: everything to be atomized

RogerCooper
In reply to this post by Veqryn
isAA
should have a few more properties

- isOnlyOneUnitActiveInCombat
- isMultiplyAttacksByNumberOfTargets
- isOnlyHitAir




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Re: everything to be atomized

ComradeKev
Administrator
In reply to this post by Veqryn
Veqryn wrote
anything happening?
Sure, summer vacation!  

Actually, I've been swamped for a couple of months with work and haven't wanted to even LOOK at a computer when I get home at night.  I got your email, and it's still at the top of my inbox- just staring at me and daring me to ignore it.  When things start to settle back down a bit (hopefully shortly after the 2nd week of August), I'll try to get back in the swing of things and begin to work on the next unstable.

I'll probably be replying to your email about the atomization of the world and we'll come to an amenable solution.  I think you're right on track with most of it though.
If emailing me at ComradeKev at yahoo.com , please add TripleA to the subject line
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Re: everything to be atomized

erik542
We really need some more kinds of territory connections, that'll open up all kinds of map design space. We need stuff like isOneWay, isOneWayCanal, isLandCanal.
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Re: everything to be atomized

ComradeKev
Administrator
erik542 wrote
We need stuff like isOneWay, isOneWayCanal, isLandCanal.
Can you give me examples of the behavior of each of these?  It'll help me visualize what you're intending.
If emailing me at ComradeKev at yahoo.com , please add TripleA to the subject line
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
There are a lot more ways we could atomize things, and a ton of features we could add, but considering the limited time and effort is there any way you could prioritize the things we done for maps that have already been made but don't work yet?

it is the list i sent as an email to you and sgb, and is also copied above,

namely the things that really really need to be done for the next unstable are:

*) allow selecting of units with zero movement

*) carriers that are also transports bug: you have a carrier carrying allied ground units and allied air units, it will not be allowed to move anywhere.  the error message is: "transports can not leave their units"
(this one is really important to fix for 3 games being designed right now)

*) paratroopers still does not work properly (can only transport infantry?)


if after you fix these, can you release an unstable that way other people can start testing all the changes you've made?
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Re: everything to be atomized

erik542
In reply to this post by ComradeKev
if the connection between Belorussia and Russia were one way for some reason, then for example, you would be able to move troops from Russia to Belorussia but not from Belorussia to Russia. is OneWayCanal would be like a particular connection would be one way unless you controlled some territory X, in short it'd be actively choosing to apply the Big World black sea bug. isLandCanal is effectively what we're looking for in RSOC, just a "canal" between to land territories, so movement between two land spots is restricted by controlling particular territories.

isOneWay could be implemented having triplea interpret this:
                <connection t1="South Laos" t2="Udon Thani"/>
to mean that, you may move stuff from South Laos to Udon Thani. So if you wanted to move men from Udon Thani to South Laos you would also need
                <connection t1="Udon Thani" t2="South Laos"/>
in your xml. Yes this would cause it to be easier to forget connections when coding larger maps, but it opens up some versatility.
isOneWayCanal would just be a synthesis of my proposed methodology for isOneWay and current canal coding.
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Re: everything to be atomized

Veqryn
Administrator
In reply to this post by Veqryn
i am bumping this


i submitted a updated version of Big World (including the new flag set, as well as relief tiles, etc.),
and also submitted a number of bug reports, etc.
all about 3 months ago...

is anything being done?

adding the new big world to triplea's next unstable would only take a single mouse click....

please
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