e40/g40 style maps

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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Richard Dixon
Hello. As an avid A&A/Triple-A player who knows nothing about actually making computer games, thanks for all your hard work in trying to bring us g40.

The one thing I will say about the map, and which belies where I am writing from, is that it would be nice and accurate for Newfoundland and Labrador to be two separate territories, not lumped-in as a land territory with the Canadian Maritimes or Quebec. Larry Harris correctly separated Labrador but left Newfoundland unnamed and part of "New Brunswick - Nova Scotia." Perhaps we might divide the general area into "Quebec," "New Brunswick - Nova Scotia," "Newfoundland" and "Labrador." I realize compromise is needed to make a 'game map' versus a real one, but Newfoundland and Labrador was a separate country (administered by Britain at the time - a long story I won't bore you with), which hosted both Canadian and American forces and provided a strategic stepping-stone in ferrying aircraft overseas to Britain.

Just a small bugaboo...matched only by my dislike of the ridiculous fact that artillery can attack and hold territory by itself; can we change that too, so that artillery can only attack in the presence of infantry and tanks? Thanks again guys, best of luck with the project.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

hepster
Hey Veqryn, not a problem.  I sensed your distaste for the projection map.  As I said, I was simply offering it up.  I love you too man!  (Nothing like public displays of man love).

Well if there is a better map that needs re-working let me know and I will help however I can.

Hi Richard,  as a Canadian I too share your desire for seeing the East coast displayed with a bit more accuracy.  Below you will see the map I am currently working on has the terr. divisions you are talking about.



In the mod I am working on I had included Newfoundland & Labrador as part of Canada, but I like the suggestion of returning the control of those regions to Britain.  It may be a while before the game is complete, but I just thought I'd let you know there will (eventually) be a game where those area's are identified and separate.  
“A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition”― Rudyard Kipling
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Prussia
@ Uboat:

Big World is a perfect Mercator projection. When I made the relief using geographic features, the map fits nicely with google map's satellite images. The coast lines all match up, even some of the boarders of territories have natural landmarks such as a mountain range or a major river. Best example: River Don flows through (for the most part) the boundary between ukraine and south russia which is just so realistic :)

Whoever drew those territories must be a genius!

@ Veq:

Mercator is by far the easiest to draw and requires least work for the same amount of accuracy (in terms of geography). People might not like certain other maps (like pacific 1940) because the shapes of the territories are way off (like Manchuria!). A very easy way to make new global maps is to take Ultimate War background and merge territories/create new ones. Then you can rescale/make changes as you like. The amount of work comparing to other projects is drastically reduced.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Veqryn
Administrator
not sure if ultimate world is the best, it seems kinds of ugly but that could just be the current territory shapes.

Big World looks pretty good, though russia, greenland, and canada are all outsized, they are not outsized as badly as some maps.

I would say the best maps are ww2v3 and domination.  


This weekend, I will take the ww2v3 and give you guys a blank one with no territories in it that you can use as template if you wish.

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http://tripleadev.1671093.n2.nabble.com/2013-TripleA-Donation-Drive-tp7583455.html
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Veqryn
Administrator
ok, here is the ww2v3 map

i left the territories in it, since i think many of like are still used for g40 (the borders of countries like france, germany, etc, are still in the map, and are useful to keep), but if you need to eliminate a territory, it is easy to erase just that line.

here you go:



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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
Did this thread die? What can I do to revive it? Veq, do you want me to trace europe, or do you want me to work with the ww2v3 map? I want the map tiles made, and then I want to work on getting units into the xml file, so I can move things around and practice.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Veqryn
Administrator
I am trying to get the engine to use the rules.  My main priority is pacific 1940, since we already have the map done for that.

I don't actually have the europe map with me, so I don't know if this map by tor is good or not.  I do know that it is ugly as hell, but that it is not his fault (because the actual map is ugly as hell too).

I'm not going to be playing it as much as some people, so Bung, I'll leave it to you to make this decision.

1) Go with the map here that Toronado made.  Turn it into both europe 1940 and global 1940.

2) Take ww2v3's base tiles.  Use them to make europe 1940, pacific 1940, and global 1940.  May require expanding.  Does at least require drawing more territory borders.

3) Do more edits to tor's map to make it look nicer.


So please pick one.
After you pick one, give/make me a png to begin working with.  I am willing to start making the map (but please test the png with polygon picker first, to make sure the png works).

Remember that, just because I already finished pacific 1940, doesn't mean that the new maps have to match.  So long as the territory names match EXACTLY then the XML will work no matter what "base" map we use.  This means if you decide to go with ww2v3 or another map base, the old pacific can become a "skin", while I only have to move the xml to another folder and everything works fine.

Also, I am a little confused on what to do about the sea zones.  Pacific's sea zones start at 1 and go all the way into the 60s I think.  Where do europe's start?  If you guys want to make my life easy, then europe's should start where Pacific's end (or else we need to have them start at 101 or something).
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Thirdoff
Europe 1940 sea zones start with 64.
Pacific 1940 SZ 1-63
Europe 1940 SZ 64-127

I have played and enjoyed this enough to offer any help.
I have graphic design tools and plenty of knowledge.
I also own both games.

I already get daily updates and test play.
How else can I help?
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
In reply to this post by Bung
OK, I'm willing to do the work finalize this, BUT for the love of god people, either don't start working on your own, or tell me that you're going to do it so I don't have to.. I am busy and don't have a lot of time, and I do NOT want to waste it if someone else is just going to do the same thing.

To be honest, I don't know what I like better, the one i have in real life or WW2v3. I will just provide both options and we can compare them.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Veqryn
In following with my above post, the first thing I wanted to do was try and make the europe map using the WW2V3 map. Mostly because Veqryn said that he likes it best, and I suppose because he said it has some originality in it.

I have got the "Big Parts" of this done, that is, getting the sizes and proportions and locations mostly right. If you want to make some comments on it, please do so quickly so I can move on to the next steps asap. I am keeping a TODO list at the bottom of things I am aware of and will be fixing.

Here is my progress/work/steps with the lastest version at the bottom: http://yojimbo.ca/triplea/
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
This post was updated on .
OK, so Uboat has mentioned that the pacific side probably needs to be redone in this style (assuming we go with ww2v3 base tiles for europe) I don't think I will tackle that any time soon since it sounds like its at least working on its own. For now my priority is to get the Europe side country lines in, and then start the map making process.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Veqryn
Administrator
I have a tweak to add,
if you can do it, awesome, if you can't, I'll live,

India's east and west sides should be the same distance north/south, and the bottom of saudi arabia should line up with the bottom on vietnam.

Basically, if it is easy to do, can you shrink all of Africa down a bit more, that way the Arabian Sea and the Bay of Bengal line up a bit better.

Anyways, looks freaking great compared with the demented looking larry-harris version.  I can't wait for this to work.  After you get the territories, i or you can run it through the map maker, and we will finally have europe and global.  (For global I will have to set all of europe sea zones starting at 101, or something like that, otherwise it is a lot of work to redo all of pacific's sea zones)

ps: don't forget to line up East and West America.

many thanks,
veqryn
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
This post was updated on .
OK, I've tried to accomplish your requested Tweak. Please see Step 15 :)

http://www.yojimbo.ca/triplea/

EDIT: Ive also now done the addition of the America's and tried like hell to get it to play nicely with the other side of the map. See link above.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Thirdoff
In reply to this post by Veqryn
The europe SZs should start with 64 through 127.  This goes right in line with Pacific ending with 63.


Are you saying it can't start with 64 or it's already start at 1?

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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Veqryn
Administrator
i don't have the europe map, so I didn't know they started at 64.   64 is perfect.

looks good bung, though your pic needs the other half to compare with
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
Oh, and you can see a Europe map on the first page of this thread, the AAorg link
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
In reply to this post by Veqryn
See step 16, seems like I added it just before you posted, you might have missed it.
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Hobbes__
Bung, just checked the redrawn iberian peninsula. Looks way better :) thanks
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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
In reply to this post by Veqryn
There is a problem with regards to lining up the right side of pacific and the left side of Europe. The sea zone connections are very specific around mexico, and so we get a bit of an issue:



As I see it we have three options

1) Fix Pacific. I don't really remember how easy it is to fix base tiles in a map, so I'm guessing this is not a great option.

2) Get the coast lines to line up and just not connect the WUS sea zone and the mexico sea zone. This would confuse the hell out of newbies though.

3) Leave it as I've done it. This is by far the easiest solution, and I can live with it.

What do you think?

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Re: e40/g40 style maps

Bung
Veq, If #1 is not hard to achieve, would you do that?... OR, if at some point someone (maybe me) wants to make pacific look a bit less "cartoonish" then it can be fixed at that time, in which case we go with #3 for now and defer #1 till that happens.
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