combat movement phase before purchase phase

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combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

erik542
Concurrence bump.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Maherdogg
but you buy units BEFORE knowing how battles turn out...

strajety.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

erik542
yes, he's proposing a universal adoption of the NWO phases. Combat move, purchase, combat, noncom, place
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Veqryn
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In reply to this post by SilverBullet
i do prefer cmb4p myself, but

i think there should be a version for each,
because combat phase before purchase phase scares away people who normally just play a&a type games, like ww2v3
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ice
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

ice
i dono anything bout programming but isnt there a way to make it an option? like clicking lowluck on and off?

ice
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

ComradeKev
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It's totally up to the map creator.  The phase order is controlled by the xml and I believe this functionality is already fully supported without issue.
If emailing me at ComradeKev at yahoo.com , please add TripleA to the subject line
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Maherdogg
again, so long as it's an option, and not the only option...
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Veqryn
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In reply to this post by SilverBullet
the downside is that it isn't exactly how a&a games get played, therefore a lot of people will refuse to play that way.  
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Veqryn
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which is why 99% of the games default to dice

the fact that you can pick low luck in the option menu is cool, but lets not make extra work for comradekev when the option you want can be simply done by the map makers themselves rather than kev.


if you want,
put together a list of games you would like a CMb4P version, and I'll do it all... just dont' make the list long.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

U-boat
Veqryn wrote
if you want,
put together a list of games you would like a CMb4P version, and I'll do it all... just dont' make the list long.
Minimap fo show.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Pablo49
There are equal reasons for any order. I'm sure there are people who would like to purchase after non-combat move, too, or after the battles. The XML is easy enough to edit to change it if you want, and if you want to play online with such a game, you can just pass around the XML to your intended players. Confining the nature of the gameplay would be more worse for the community than having it open. Being open allows for a wider range of players and ways to play. Personally, sometimes I want to play more of a tradition A&A game, and would want to purchase first, and sometimes I want to do combat moves first. I'd be more upset if I didn't have the ability to choose.

Also, in your bunting example: Bunting isn't a required way to play, and you don't bunt every pitch. You do it when it is appropriate or if you choose to. Same goes for this. NWO is a totally different game than WWII, besides just the turn order. All the other aspects of the game would have to be identical to draw that kind of conclusion.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

SilverBullet
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Mongol General: What is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, to see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

OnanTheBrBr
Just some "historical" input:

I was the one changing the turn-order for NWO (guerillaJ's idea it was, btw.).
When I introduced it, I was worried about players not adopting it, since most players dont like changes. I also knew that the result would be the one OR the other, not two solutions. There is only place for one version, since that is the dynamics of the community, as Silverbullet pointed out correctly.
Not wanting the increasing popularity of my NWO version to become hurt, I made 2 versions of the map. I named one "#NEW WORLD ORDER#", the other "#NEW WORLD ORDER# traditional", in order to give the version with the CMb4P a little headstart. All that took place during the TripleA "unstable" period, so there were several little changes and fixes daily, and I can say it was a major pain to maintain 2 versions then.

Actually, it turned out I never saw anyone play the "traditional" version. "There is only place for one version"


2 versions of a map also means 2 different names needed for these 2 maps. This usually keeps players rather effectively from playing alternative versions, since most get scared by non-standard names (with some right even...).

Concluding, I the only person spending time on two map versions would be Veqryn making them. Two versions are no solution, in my eyes.

On the other hand, I also acknowledge that the "boardgame-related" maps draw new blood into the community, and thus should not scare anyone away. With no though spend, people can easily fail to realize CMb4P virtually makes no difference (*). So while making CMb4P standard nicely would contribute to vaccinate TripleA against future DMCA claims, I am divided about this.

What I believe to be the best solution actually, is the already mentioned implementation of an option. That way, CMb4P games dont look different from "traditional" games in the Lobby, thus not scaring people away. People just would have to put their preferred settings into the comments, like LL and TTL. "Traditional" could stay the default mode then, just like "dice" are, in order to be as boardgame-convert friendly as possible.

Regards,
EB

*
For correctness sake:
There is two differences in CMb4P. Both pretty rare though, and none of them severe.
1. Currently, a unit walking into an completly empty (!) enemy capital immidiatly captures their money, resulting in the captor to spend that money immidiatly in that turn. Could be prevented by handing over captured money only at the end of the captors turn. Should almost never be an issue in the WW2 maps.
2. Casualties from AA fly-overs are know prior to the purchase. There is no solution to this one. But its both very rare as well as not exactly detrimental to the gameplay.
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Re: combat movement phase before purchase phase

Veqryn
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onan is right on this,
there are also 1 more consequence, just to get technical: maybe you make a move that only works with a certain purchase, then when you get to the purchase screen you realize you don't have enough money to buy that purchase.


here is my honest opinion:

Basic a&a maps (ww2v3 1941, ww2v2 revised, ww2v4 1942, etc), should stay "traditional".  I actually had someone complain about napoleonic being cmbp, and he said he couldn't get into it, and stopped playing because of it.  I think we should keep the basic maps the normal way, the ones that attract new people to this game, the ones that they expect to work a Certain way, and when it doesn't they get frustrated and leave.  

Advanced maps (NWO, Napoleonic, Really Big Maps, etc) should be CMBP.  I'll be making domination into cmbp, but since I don't see any more maps being requested, I won't be changing any old maps that noone plays.  New future maps that are advanced in nature can be cmbp.  The reason here is, maps like NWO and Nap introduce people to the idea of CMBP and show them that there really is not much difference, or no difference at all in some maps (like Napoleonic Empires does not have airplanes, and also has fortresses in all capitals, so the things EB mentioned do not affect this map).  Once the player has been introduced to the idea of CMBP, then they can use a special variant to play the basic maps that way IF they wish to.
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