Domination 1914: No Mans Land

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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
No This game is well balanced believe me look at the game. German product power higher than 150. Cairo will fall. Germany is expanding in pacific and africa and hold scandinavia and western front. And Russia will collapse.

xml_2016_11_02_Domination_1914_No_Mans_Land_round_5.xml
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
Navalland, Can you post a save game? I cannot get that XML to load. I'm interested to see how Germany is doing so well everywhere, and did the UK build battleships? I cannot find any possible way for Germany to survive against a UK battleship spam, even if you take Russia once you lose control of the ocean its really hard to do anything.

I agree many players play the centrals poorly, and that the best strategy is to focus resources on Russia while trying to spread the UK thin by attacking many different locations (Cairo and Pacific are both so important). I think making Bulgaria German would be very interesting, however currently Serbia is able to very reliably take Bulgaria so you may need to heavily rebalance that area.

@bevan
I am normally seeing Arabia lose its capital very quickly, turn 3 or 4, so I don't see how bombing them works. For the nations without comments, I think that might be where the disagreement is rooted. Austria is difficult to play as you need to split your armies in 3 directions and face tough decisions for what unit type to produce.

Italy can actually do a lot, for example buy a zeppelin turn 1. This forces multiple AA gun purchases from the opponent because it can threaten many factories, and after they spent so much more than you did you still have a unit to trade territory and and extra casualty for naval combat. I'm also building a lot less factories than you are, building bigger units works just fine and IMO you definently should be using the African and Canadian factories. I don't think 1 factory as France is wrong but unless you have made enormous income gains I would never build 2

The thing about techs is, unless I'm playing an outdated version, you cannot choose them. In my experience you need certain techs as Centrals, and you need the Entente to not get certain techs as well
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
I dont know how can I upload my save game. I just know to put load xml.

I always believe that Germany must separate own resources in the following way: 3/5 Against UK 1/5 Against France and 1/5 against Russia. This Mean if Germany exceed the lmit of 140-150 Thats pretty possible with propaganda /victory bonds or without. Germany can spend 90 pus against UK in every turn almost the same total UK power. UK cannot resist against German 90 Pus+Turkey. That's key point Germany should minimum spend especially against France. And spend minimum trench.

UK would lost all the Pacific Africa and even India if try to kill German navy with Battleship mass. Because 2 Criser is definitely more strong than 1 battleship at the same time 2 crusiers are cheaper than 1 battleship. UK can product max 3 battleship per round against German fleet. Just create 6 cruiser against this tactic. Normally I always try to kill German Navy with cruiser-submarine spawn but If my oppopnent try this tactic (3/5 Against UK 1/5 Against France and 1/5 against Russia) I never try to kill German Navy and I Prefer so spend minimum cost to hold sz 25 than I try to kill German Navy with the USA Navy.
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

lordbevan
 Navalland, you have your own version of the map, but whats the difference?
Is the original creator give up on this map and ur the new creator?
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
My maps are sucks Dom 1914 is the best Triplea map. No I am not new creator.
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
In reply to this post by Navalland
I got that xml working. What was the UK buying? It looks like he just has nothing, and it looks like France built too many defensive units (I build field guns and fighters). Did france place in Tobruk every turn? I always do, and I send other african units to Cairo, cairo is the only major win i see for the centrals and it looks like the entetne just didn't reinforce as much as they could have (I would have 6 trenches on it by that point), there are also many heavy guns which I wouldn't have bought. No zeppelins? They are such good value against those unprotected factories

That shanghai factory is interesting as well, this is far more Pacific heavy with Germany that I have ever tried myself or played against, however I don't see how the centrals are winning.

The reason I say centrals cannot win is because Germany must win the naval battle with UK, and if it invests enough to win at sea it can't win on land. A battleship stack doesn't try to win in one battle (cruisers do that better), it wants to attack and retreat every turn, getting free repairs while sinking ships. If one side goes battleships the other either must go battleships or never let his fleet get hit,
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
UK Player coudnt invest to Cairo much more because engaged in the atlantic and pacific.French support to Cairo is good idea but Cairo is %90 doomed to fall unless massive investment and early good techs.
Thats important things yes first rounds naval battles are very critic especially in sz 16. Germany have to take sz 16 and hold this area after the naval battle. There must be 1 German battleship 2 battlecruiser and cruiser. German Sub bid is essential. Pretty possible to win against UK.

Zeppelin is overpriced and pretty useless I think. Zeppelin must have this features 2 at 1 def 5 movement and 12 cost. And all countries should start captal aa Gun's. Otherwise strategically useless. Sadly this map wasn t created according to mulltiple holding and creating deadzone strategy for the early game. Because lack of great mobile units (Except Zeppelin and Late fighter though Zeppelin is useless expensive and have weak attack, Late fighter is excellent Unit Germany can hold westfront and Uk navy simultaneously with late spawn but finding Late fighter in the Early game is very luck depends.) Maybe all countries should start with Late fighter tech.But I am undecided because extremely good unit for Central.

Heavy gun is definitely better unit than field gun (except creeping barage and naval-base countries because trannies can carry only 1 heavy gun) you are buying +2 more defense power in exchange of 1 pus.  In the field gun you are buying +1 attack power in exchange of 1 pus.
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Imbaked
Do you guys actually want to work on this? My son is 2 now and I hacd more time again (and still lots of ideas) but I would need help

Sent from my LG Mobile

------ Original message------
From: Navalland [via tripleadev]
Date: Thu, Nov 3, 2016 2:28 AM
To: Imbaked;
Cc:
Subject:Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

UK Player coudnt invest to Cairo much more because engaged in the atlantic and pacific.French support to Cairo is good idea but Cairo is %90 doomed to fall unless massive investment and early good techs.
Thats important things yes first rounds naval battles are very critic especially in sz 16. Germany have to take sz 16 and hold this area after the naval battle. There must be 1 German battleship 2 battlecruiser and cruiser. German Sub bid is essential. Pretty possible to win against UK.

Zeppelin is overpriced and pretty useless I think. Zeppelin must have this features 2 at 1 def 5 movement and 12 cost. And all countries should start captal aa Gun's. Otherwise strategically useless. Sadly this map wasn t created according to mulltiple holding and creating deadzone strategy for the early game. Because lack of great mobile units (Except Zeppelin and Late fighter though Zeppelin is useless expensive and have weak attack, Late fighter is excellent Unit Germany can hold westfront and Uk navy simultaneously with late spawn but finding Late fighter in the Early game is very luck depends.) Maybe all countries should start with Late fighter tech.But I am undecided because extremely good unit for Central.

Heavy gun is definitely better unit than field gun (except creeping barage and naval-base countries because trannies can carry only 1 heavy gun) you are buying +2 more defense power in exchange of 1 pus.  In the field gun you are buying +1 attack power in exchange of 1 pus.



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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
In reply to this post by Navalland
Cairo won't hold forever, but there are Italian troops sitting in Africa doing nothing that really should be in Egypt. Cairo is the priority, its only two production there is no excuse to not fill it completely every turn. France can pump 4 colonials, and large amounts of infantry and field guns. You want to force germany to match your numbers, you can get 16 units a turn + Americans + british (why send brits to mexico? Take it with starting USA cavalry, and get those men fighting in europe ASAP). I have never seen Belgium hold this long

Field gun provides support, its +2 attack power for 1 PU (it gives support) and becomes broken if you get creeping barrage. I would only purchase a heavy gun when I certainly need defense (Cairo) but for a nation like France once its clear Germany isn't trying to rush Paris the field gun is much better (as France you are an offensive nation, your goal is to take and hold territory)

On zeppelins you are wrong, try it if you don't believe. Italy buys a zeppelin round one, it can strat bomb venice and trieste. So it either gets a lot of free bombing damage, or Austria builds 2 AA guns. If they build two AA guns, reposition to Greece, threaten Ottoman capital or Belgrade if Austria takes and holds it. Either it deals 3.5 PU damage a turn or forces the opponent to spend 24 PUs on AA guns which are mostly useless. Aim for the long game with Entente, believe me you can win even if Russia falls just play it out
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
Also edit to the above- I forgot you played with a German sub bid. That changes the early turns against UK fundamentally, I'm playing a game with that rule now and I will see how it goes. Crazy how one unit changes things so much.
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Imbaked
Hi Imbaked these are my demans if you are interested;

-Delete Serbian techs
-Industry placing +2 much more unit
-Zeppelin 2 attack 1 defense 5 movement 12 cost
-Fix connection and propaganda bugs
-Propaganda=Germany gets 3 stormtruppen instead of 3 infantry
-Germany starts +1 more sub in the north sea
-Germany starts wtih Bulgaria
-German New Guinea=3
-All countries starts with capital aaGuns
-Seems Merchant Marine is a bit overpowered
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
In reply to this post by crazy_german
if Germany kills canadian trannies in round 1 you cannot sent canadian troops to europe also UK cannot use canadian troops in the europe effectively if there are strong German navy. The best choice for canadian troops is farming taking maxico with the uk is better than taking with usa because strong uk is more useful.

Zeppelin is bad unit.Italy may not retake to milan if Austria gets good dice than Austrian player might decide to kill italy firstly. I prefer to create a USA zeppelin than travel all of the Europe.

ok zeppelin is good unit according to you but 2 zeppelin? is there any reason to buy 2 zeppelin.  if your opposit create aa guns?

Is there any zeppelin's strategic positions except bombing feature?
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

panzerman
In reply to this post by crazy_german
just more to gas bwhahahahaha


On Thursday, November 3, 2016 12:19 PM, crazy_german [via tripleadev] <[hidden email]> wrote:


Cairo won't hold forever, but there are Italian troops sitting in Africa doing nothing that really should be in Egypt. Cairo is the priority, its only two production there is no excuse to not fill it completely every turn. France can pump 4 colonials, and large amounts of infantry and field guns. You want to force germany to match your numbers, you can get 16 units a turn + Americans + british (why send brits to mexico? Take it with starting USA cavalry, and get those men fighting in europe ASAP). I have never seen Belgium hold this long

Field gun provides support, its +2 attack power for 1 PU (it gives support) and becomes broken if you get creeping barrage. I would only purchase a heavy gun when I certainly need defense (Cairo) but for a nation like France once its clear Germany isn't trying to rush Paris the field gun is much better (as France you are an offensive nation, your goal is to take and hold territory)

On zeppelins you are wrong, try it if you don't believe. Italy buys a zeppelin round one, it can strat bomb venice and trieste. So it either gets a lot of free bombing damage, or Austria builds 2 AA guns. If they build two AA guns, reposition to Greece, threaten Ottoman capital or Belgrade if Austria takes and holds it. Either it deals 3.5 PU damage a turn or forces the opponent to spend 24 PUs on AA guns which are mostly useless. Aim for the long game with Entente, believe me you can win even if Russia falls just play it out
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German



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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
In reply to this post by Navalland
Well if you add a german sub it changes the UK's opening moves quite a bit, so my comments on that don't apply if you add that sub. I still think UK should make an effort to get a transport chain going though, colonials are really good value

All I would ask is that you play a game where you buy a zeppelin with Italy, and let me know how it goes. I would love to see my opponent try to kill Italy first. Of course you would only build a zeppelin to use its bombing, which is only powerful because there are no AA guns at the start. I would say that a Zeppelin without bombing ability is about equal to a fighter (less attack but more movement), maybe slightly worse, but better for naval combat because it does have decent range, its attack sucks but that extra hit point can swing a battle.

Obviously if you get bad dice italy first turn, it would be very risky to go zeppelin, and I wouldn't build 2 in the same area. But the goal is actually that your opponent does build AA guns. If they build 2 to respond to 1 zeppelin that means you got a 4 PU zeppelin, which is awesome. If they build 3 they spend more than you did AND you still get a useful unit. They are harder to get use out of in other places, particularly for the Centrals because they are very slow to get value.

I think if you analyze that game, you will see many areas where the Entente could have done small things to improve their situation. For instance there are troops sitting in Tripoli where they are totally useless, I also suspect that Germany got very above average dice in the indian ocean submarine battles, otherwise I don't see how it got so much territory in Africa. It also looks like Italy did nothing all game(so I don't see why a zeppelin buy is such an odd idea)
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
In reply to this post by panzerman
I have tried and failed many times to gas rush France, I would love to see a game where Germany does so against a competent opponent.

Referring to that game above, it looks like France and Italy both play defensively when its clear the opponent is making no effort to conquer them right now.
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Navalland
In reply to this post by Navalland
Or zeppelin 2 at 1 def 5 mov and 14 cost. 16 is expensive in exchange of 1 attack.
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

lordbevan
Zeppelin is fine. Unprotected transports have no defense so 1 zep will keep them far away.
Also, strategic bombing is still profitable and suits the Entente more as they have more income, thus delaying the enemy.


About Central Powers they are giving enough advantages as it is. (to the point of being ridiculous)
1)Germany is stronger than USA???
Maybe take some income from UK to give to USA?? As USA takes some time to deploy, this makes Germany have a better chance in the first few rounds.

2)Germany can create 20 stormtroopers while Britain create 6 Colonials and France just 4?

3)Berlin is 20 PU, Venice is 12, while Paris is 8 and London is just 5? This makes France and Britain really in need of Industry tech.

With these advantages there is no need to give more to Centrals but you might want to take away from the Entente. E.g. Serbia and Greece split up into 2 smaller nations so that the Balkans are not an immediate problem. Albania should just be neutral.

About the German in Pacific, you can consider removing factory in Singapore and 1 from India. Germany cannot match the British on a 1 to 1 basis in production power in the Pacific and Africa.
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

crazy_german
A really big issue is that Germany's storm troopers take forever to get into combat. Its a 5 turn march to Paris from Berlin, while the supply line from USA or Canada to Paris takes 3 turns (Merchant marine makes it just 2). Yakutsk and Berlin are the same distance from St. Petersburg (7 spaces).

Austria and Turkey have similar problems, at any give time the Centrals have so many soldiers just marching through their own territory, not threatening the enemy. The Entente gets to build their soldiers right on the front line

Changing the starting British-German naval match up could help. With a sub bid, germany can usually safely take Sea Zone 16. I find that these battles are very dice heavy and determine too much, especially in the Indian Ocean.
Correctly crazy, disingenuously German
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

redrum
Administrator
Sounds like someone should host a tournament to see how balanced it really is :)
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Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Imbaked
A few basic tweaks need to be made. I have a copy somewhere with the simple fixes of connections and prop fix and a couple balance thinga. ill look for it havnt touched it in 3 years. Can i skip the upload process if i find it?

Sent from my LG Mobile

------ Original message------
From: redrum [via tripleadev]
Date: Fri, Nov 4, 2016 11:59 AM
To: Imbaked;
Cc:
Subject:Re: Domination 1914: No Mans Land

Sounds like someone should host a tournament to see how balanced it really is :)


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